15 replies to this topic

[websherpa]

My new/old Maygay Monopoly green has been humming along nicely for days since I got it, I happen to fiddle a bit with some loose bolts on the reel mount and AARGH! a Reel Error on Reel 3. It did sound like something was rubbing, tried to clear everything out of the way, blew dust off the optics, reseated connectors/looms and still the error. I did notice that this reel does turn with a little more friction than the others.

The opto interruptor leaf is triggering the led indicator, so I am suspecting a "speed" issue.

Would this be correct to assume? Any hints on where to look first, can the stepper motors be lubricated, etc.

Thank you.

[lincs1]

My new/old Maygay Monopoly green has been humming along nicely for days since I got it, I happen to fiddle a bit with some loose bolts on the reel mount and AARGH! a Reel Error on Reel 3. It did sound like something was rubbing, tried to clear everything out of the way, blew dust off the optics, reseated connectors/looms and still the error. I did notice that this reel does turn with a little more friction than the others.

The opto interruptor leaf is triggering the led indicator, so I am suspecting a "speed" issue.

Would this be correct to assume? Any hints on where to look first, can the stepper motors be lubricated, etc.

Thank you.

i think the reel motor is at its life end. reel motors are not servicible parts

[websherpa]

If that's the case (again AARGH!) where best to find out the correct replacement and order one that might ship to Canada? I have relatives in the UK to ship to if necessary.

thanks!

[lincs1]

If that's the case (again AARGH!) where best to find out the correct replacement and order one that might ship to Canada? I have relatives in the UK to ship to if necessary.

thanks!

u could try bazpeeb he may have one in his workshop at work or u could try

JNC (EXPORT) SALES or try on ebay under video games/fruit machines and do a search for reels

[roderz]

"It did sound like something was rubbing"

Then something probably is, take reel out completely and check everything, sometimes the loom guides come loose and rub (clear plastic piece at bottom of reel - not always fitted)
Or if it fitted with a lamp mask on top of the bulb holders - these can pop off as well

[websherpa]

A genius needed....

I did a little experiment tonight and I think it may not be the motor specifically.

First off, I was occasionally getting the machine to boot without a Reel error (Reel 3 is giving the 2.3 error), but usually it would error within a spin or two, or after a few steps in test mode. Generally it would get stuck a half step or so out of alignment somewhere along the line.

[As background, when I got the machine last week it was playing fine (no reel errors), but it was occasionally resetting. I reseated all the socketted chips and repluged all the connectors and it stopped resetting. It played fine. Then I had to move the Reel shelf for some reason, a light was rubbing or something. When I put it back, I started getting reel errors.]

I checked and recalibrated the 5 volts to a steady 5 volts, but haven't checked the other voltages, though the proper LEDs light on the MPU.

I took the reels out to clean and check for obstructions, clean the optos, etc.

Putting them back in I was getting more consistent Reel errors.

I traded reel places (traded reel 3 for reel 2) to see if it would give me the error in position 2.

And it still gave me a 2.3 (Reel 3) error, meaning that it was giving me the error on the "good" reel I swapped. The error seems to be localized to the third reel circuit.

So perhaps it's not the stepper motor after all?

Any ideas what else might be responsible or how to chase down the problem (I have a logic probe, etc.) I'll begin by generally testing all the transistors and diodes in the circuit, but since I don't have a schematic, it's hard to isolate exactly what I am to be looking at.

Many thanks for all your help,

Wayne

(a Canadian who spent a few summers as a youth in Blackpool, finally got a Fruit Machine in Canada after wanting one for more than 20 years - and now it's just sitting there - baahh! )

[roderz]

If you have established that its not the reel itself then its either the reel driver board or the loom between reel and brd, try swaping the loom to see if the fault moves.
if it does then it is the loom, check for dodgy crimps on the reel loom or a 'flat' crimp that may not be making a good enough contact. (have a look at the holes on the connector of the loom to see if any crimps are squashed flat)

[websherpa]

If you have established that its not the reel itself then its either the reel driver board or the loom between reel and brd, try swaping the loom to see if the fault moves.
if it does then it is the loom, check for dodgy crimps on the reel loom or a 'flat' crimp that may not be making a good enough contact. (have a look at the holes on the connector of the loom to see if any crimps are squashed flat)

Very good advice, thank you. I will try that as part of my troubleshooting this evening for sure!

Wayne

[websherpa]

It's a picky problem for sure (I haven't taken apart the loom connectors to see if it's the crimps yet). Moving the look=m connectors across to another loom doesn't duplicate the error however. Whichever loom is disconencted (since the loom isn't long enough for me to switch all three) causes the error (as expected), but when they're put back together, it's always Reel 3 that gives the error.

The problem IS intermittent though (which again suggests connector issues), as after replacing the looms it worked fine for at least 15 plays until I realized that I had still swapped the reels around for my previous test (so of course I couldn't get a win).

I stopped the machine, switched the reels, reconnected the loom, and bam, back to the same problem, but more intermittent, that is last night I got 100% reel failures, now I am getting maybe 60%.

[websherpa]

All that help and troubleshooting paid off. After fiddling with connectors and donig continuity tests, the connectors seemed like a possibility but a long shot. So instead of putting new headers on them, I thought I'd take a look at the MPU, see if there were any obvious cold solder joints on the header pins, obviosu signs of a previous repair, etc.

Well I knew that the Varta 2.4v 100mAh NI-CD battery was acting up, so I had sourced a semi-suitable replacement from the local surplus store and I had intended to mount it OFF the MPU board which is the standard practice here when refurbing pinball motherboards.

Well low an behold there was evidence of battery leakage on the motherboard! (A common occurence in the pinball trade, which is why we move them off the MPU). Battery leakage can cause all sorts of damage, and gaming distributors have been accused of leaving this vulnerability in their machines so that they WILL go bad. Once a machine is down or costing more in repairs than its worth, the operator is likely to replace it - hence planned obsolecence.

In any case after removing the old leaky battery, broke out the lighted magnifier and I discovered some bad acid damage, AND two tiny broken traces (I use a DMM with a continuity "beeper" to do the tracing). Some micro surgery soldering in some tiny copper strands and voila, it's working perfectly, save a coupel burned out bulbs.

I did some major cleaning of the MPU board, but I'll likely go in and do some more to be safe. I hate plugging and unplugging those connectors though as they do have a limited number of pulls to their effective life.

I discovered that the third stepper reel motor, while functional is slowly failing, I had to use the adjustment to bring it in line with the other two reels.

I also discovered that who ever converted this to 120volts forgot to a) ground the added step up (120v - 220v) transformer and disconnected one of the grounds from the power supply to the MPU (likely not critical - but hey!)

If you've read this far then you know that I'm tickled pink with my handi-work.

The only thing that's bugging me, and this may be a lack of knowledge on my part, but whoever converted this to 120volts cut the +5 volt feeds for the MPU and then installed ANOTHER regulated power supply to convert from 120v to a stable +5. I wonder if it has anything to do with using the step up convertor? I test +5 volts coming from the original power supply (fed off the original toroidal transformer and circuitry), but I don't have an oscilliscope, nor do I remember how to test with a DMM for AC ripple on a DC power supply.

Oh well, it works. I play. I'm happy. I have yet to hit a jackpot (at 78% odds). Tomorrow I install an auxilliary L-Pad for a "night time" volume control, hide the "cheat" credit switch and reconnect the coin mech, and install a DIP (DIL) Switch so that I can change the machine's odds at random. Waiting for some light bulbs. And once I get some tokens (thanks Baz) I'll actually be able to play it like it's supposed to be played.

(We usually hike our Pachislos to close to 100% payout when we have guests, it keeps everyone happy.)

Thanks everyone!!

[websherpa]

It's worth mentioning that the Mempac MPU battery sits directly over traces from the reel optics connector and circuits. So the traces etched by the acid included a link to the battery (hence error 4.2 each power-up) and the reel three opto.

I advice others (as we do for pinball machines), move those batteries OFF the MPU, they will eventually leak and cause all sorts of troubles.

[skabaz]

well done mate

thats a fault that only would have solved if someone was actually looking at the machine and not over the net so once again well done considering this was your first uk fruit machine.

just to let you know i', getting the package weighed today so will let you know tonight.

regards
baz

[websherpa]

It was a short lived victory. The machien survived all day long yesterday then started failing again.

It appears to need multiple resets when trying to acheive the 12mm volts, then when it gets it it does the reel test and one of the reels fails (now reel 4, before it was reel 3).

I tested the 12volts unregulated coming from the original UK power supply, and it's coming out only 10v. So I thought to try the North American power supply that was added to get a steady 5volts (it has a steady 12volt 2Amp tap). When I do this I get a total 12mm failure LED.

So back to the drawing board. I guess the problem is the MPU, so I'll have to retest all the pcb traces.

If the problem is the power supply, does anyone know if just recapping it (and testing diodes, resistors and transistors) would likely be enough to resurrect it?

Is it common for a 15 year old power supply to fail? I know that they purposely build these things so they have a limited life.

Thanks again all.

[lincs1]

It was a short lived victory. The machien survived all day long yesterday then started failing again.

It appears to need multiple resets when trying to acheive the 12mm volts, then when it gets it it does the reel test and one of the reels fails (now reel 4, before it was reel 3).

I tested the 12volts unregulated coming from the original UK power supply, and it's coming out only 10v. So I thought to try the North American power supply that was added to get a steady 5volts (it has a steady 12volt 2Amp tap). When I do this I get a total 12mm failure LED.

So back to the drawing board. I guess the problem is the MPU, so I'll have to retest all the pcb traces.

If the problem is the power supply, does anyone know if just recapping it (and testing diodes, resistors and transistors) would likely be enough to resurrect it?

Is it common for a 15 year old power supply to fail? I know that they purposely build these things so they have a limited life.

Thanks again all.

it seems it could either be a dry joint on the reel pins on the mpu or a faulty loom harness

failing that then yes it will be a faulty psu

[websherpa]

A niave question I am sure, but do the reels run off 12v DC or AC?

[websherpa]

A niave question I am sure, but do the reels run off 12v DC or AC?

The reason I ask is because the 10v I read off the reel power lines was in DC, and I got to thinking that maybe it's an AC motor...

... if that's the case then the problem is clearly connectors or pcb traces.

Thanks!