42 replies to this topic

[cardie]

Long story short.

 

I have a Maygay Geronimo (Impulse) fruit machine, year 2000, Epoch Tech, early not the one stop system.

 

A very generous memeber has sent me a few boards and I now have a total of 4. So heres what they do.

 

Number 1. The machines original board, battery damaged and thinks all the dip switches are on so gives a note acceptor error and bad lamp sequencing.

 

Number 2. Boots and works for about 1 min, always gives ram reset, then reels go out of line and eventually it locks up.

 

Number 3. Same as above but didnt give Ram reset for about 4 or 5 boots, now always does it, reels go out of line after 3 or 4 mins but doesnt lock up.

 

Number 4. Doesnt boot, I just hear the PSU clicking a relay every few mins, non of the other boards respond.

 

So my theory is, 1 and 4 are probably dead, as I cannot fathom out what its broken making all the DIPs stay on 1 when they are all off.

 

2 and 3 seem to work fine, for a few mins then the reels start to go out of alignment, 2 being thr worst as sometimes the reels wont spin just judder, some stay 'solid' and some do the 200hz buzzing (to keep the motors cool I think?) 3 doesnt do this all the motors are as normal buzzing away.

 

SOOOO I have a theorey that the problem (as suggested by a member) is the PSU overloading the boards as the problems for 2 and 3 take time for the problems to happen, but... this isnt the case with board 1 as when I manage to get it into demo mode it plays flawlessly.

 

What can I be testing to make sure the PSU is ok and isnt f*****g all these boards Its seems to be a good PSU it doesnt look that old. All the lights are a good strong green on the board and PSU, 12v is slightly dimmer than the rest but 12v its the biggest load on an Epoch system and anything that ive measued around 12v is bang on.

 

Any help will be rewarded with cake.

 

Thank you and Merry Christmas!

[aaamusements]

PSU needs opening up, to see what board it has in it. Early ones were troublesome, some caught fire.

Later DJP nodded boards were so much better.

Take a photo and I'll tell you which version it is...

[Guitar]

Working fine for a few minutes then breaking sounds like PSU. I just had this with Eastenders and swapping out the PSU fixed it.

 

But that's M1 tech so sort of irrelevant for now.

 

First of check all your connectors are seated properly, check pins for signs of burning (a sign of a loose connector).

Next up RAM fail means 1 of 4 things, either...

          1) The RAM itself has failed and is failing the checksum on boot of the machine. This can happen, but from experience with epoch, it's probably not the case.

2) The battery has failed, meaning the ram is lost on power down and again this will cause a checksum failure at boot, causing the RAM RESET alarm.

3) The circuitry around the battery, either a chip or a track has failed.

4) Screwed up power supply can cause RAM RESET, if the power to the CPU is wobbly, it can cause the CPU to write things to the wrong place in RAM, which will cause the reset failure.

 

If you have access to a known good working board, plug that in and see if it fails, of it does it's PSU, if not its the board itself.

 

The way epoch is designed, you should NEVER power up a board with known battery damage, this can cause all sorts of issues. If you have a damaged board, get it fixed before you power it up and it should be fine.

[andrew96]

Mk 1 epoch psu, yes its true they burn up, 2 caps go, but then never give out overvolts! there buck converters and if fail they give no outputs not high outputs, mk 2 psu just stop giving outputs when they fail, again they fail 'safe'

 

it will be 100%  the epoch main boards, the main epoch mpu is right near the battery and really really suffers with battery vapour damage, no point trying to repair them as once the alkaline rot sets in you wont get rid of it as the main cpu pins are too close together to stop leakage across the boards. 

 

just buy known working and fully tested boards, anything other than that and there bound to have problems! you have yet to find a epoch board that intermittently dumps its hopper, but buy boards off ebay and your likely to come across that board trouble too! they also can give faults such as very very flickery lights when in attract mode, bit on boot there all lit just fine (until attract kicks in), not responding to button presses. a whole list of faults down to the epoch mpu board!

 

as I said just buy known tested and working boards and pay the money, worth it in the long run

[andrew96]

PSU needs opening up, to see what board it has in it. Early ones were troublesome, some caught fire.

Later DJP nodded boards were so much better.

Take a photo and I'll tell you which version it is...

Mk 2 boards go dead just as much, and are much more difficult and more expensive to repair than mk 1 versions.

 

look at this mk 2, just a blown R26, so you would think.....

 

 epoch psu 3.JPG   106.51KB   2 downloads

 

so much more than that, replaced the parts shown below and STILL had then to change the psu 8 pin driver chip too as that was blown internally too! lots of hassle!

 

 epoch psu parts.JPG   149.75KB   3 downloads

psu chip change

 

 epoch psu 2.JPG   136.62KB   1 downloads

sorry last pic should have been this one showing the chip removal

 

 epoch psu chip 2.JPG   151.59KB   1 downloads

[andrew96]

epoch reel boards are evil too!

 

 epoch reel board 1.JPG   155.84KB   2 downloads

 

 epoch reel board 2.JPG   167.08KB   1 downloads

 

 

[andrew96]

another bad chip on  a epoch sub board, think this was a hopper / meter drive board, not sure now, but see the brown mark on the top where the inside of the chip decided to burn up all by its self, no high voltages here to cause that.

 

 IMG_2024a.jpg   32.73KB   2 downloads

[andrew96]

And those mk 2 lamp boards!!! they STILL used surface mount drive transistors, these burnt up nicely on the mk 1 boards, and guess what! they STILL burn up on the mk2 boards too!! no improvement what so ever on the parts that actually blow! the big transistors they did change and uprate didn't actually go on the mk 1 boards either! think they got it wrong as uprated the wrong ones!

[stanmarsh14]

And those mk 2 lamp boards!!! they STILL used surface mount drive transistors, these burnt up nicely on the mk 1 boards, and guess what! they STILL burn up on the mk2 boards too!! no improvement what so ever on the parts that actually blow! the big transistors they did change and uprate didn't actually go on the mk 1 boards either! think they got it wrong as uprated the wrong ones!

 

Indeed, hence why I feel a bit or resentment every time I go past DJP's in Derby (The jokers that made these boards), and get a sudden bout of Tourettes.

[Guitar]

Flickery lamps is a dodgy PSU, not a board issue.

[andrew96]

Flickery lamps is a dodgy PSU, not a board issue.

 

Not on the one I looked at! psu was rock steady, and when the machine booted it did the usual turn all lamps on during initialization, all was perfect! was only when it went into attract and the mpu failed to talk to the lamp board properly that very flickery lamps then occurred! psu was perfect and I had load tested it too so know it was not to blame. also it didn't want to see the switches properly for the features, was the mpu at fault

[cardie]

The first board for my Geronimo gives flickery lamps, the other 3 dont, so it cant be a PSU issue.

[cardie]

Heres the PSU

 

 

I have a bit of an update for board 2.

 

Ive kept that one in as it seems to work the longest,

 

Booted it up before and ive noticed if theres lots of interfernce through the speaker it seems to run sweet, if I so much as open a door and it resets somtimes this interference goes and probably 2 or 3 mins later the reels go out of alignment, this time it was that bad the machine actually locked up like board 3 does.

 

 

Attached Files

•  20141202_115333.jpg   141.22KB   2 downloads

[stanmarsh14]

Heres the PSU

 

 

I have a bit of an update for board 2.

 

Ive kept that one in as it seems to work the longest,

 

Booted it up before and ive noticed if theres lots of interfernce through the speaker it seems to run sweet, if I so much as open a door and it resets somtimes this interference goes and probably 2 or 3 mins later the reels go out of alignment, this time it was that bad the machine actually locked up like board 3 does.

 

 

 

K, you have a MK1 PCB fitted, and it's quite common to get interference through the speakers on these..... the MK2's (These are T-shaped) are certainly from my own experience, much better with the speakers issue, however they too also have their own issues as Andrew will probs explain.

[andrew96]

just remove the 2 caps circled in pink and then you wont get the fireworks when they decide to go up in smoke! epoch is generally a noisy machine, might be helped if you replace all 3 caps marked in blue circles, but then it might not help! psus generally suffer from transformer rattle as the top cover is too close to the transformer, not a lot can be done really, just accept there noisy!

 

 post-3232-0-81522500-1417534914.jpg   142.38KB   10 downloads

[cardie]

just remove the 2 caps circled in pink and then you wont get the fireworks when they decide to go up in smoke! epoch is generally a noisy machine, might be helped if you replace all 3 caps marked in blue circles, but then it might not help! psus generally suffer from transformer rattle as the top cover is too close to the transformer, not a lot can be done really, just accept there noisy!

 

post-3232-0-81522500-1417534914.jpg

Is there anyway to test these caps are bad? Would this be causing these sort of issues, and I know epoch is noisey through the speaker in general, its always done that, but when its 'working' the noise is twice as loud as its every been?

[andrew96]

Yes a capacitor tester or esr meter, but you wont have that test equipment! these 3 caps are known to fail, had a few now, they just smooth the output a little on some of the voltage rails, forget now which one does which rail as not near my paperwork to look it up, best to just do all 3, can get ones from maplin

audio amp is probably picking up address and data nearby and you hear that as noise! battery damage causes conductive paths and that can be why noise changes depending on what the machine is doing, again its epoxy boards!

[Mavroz]

Same old same old Epoch..... General advice.

 

These machines are notoriously difficult to get running, hence why people give them away or sell them for peanuts.

 

The only way to start with these is replace Psu card, Replace main Mpu and Replace lamp board to start with..... 4 out of 5 machines i have had i have done this and all have been fine and are still running.

 

Still having problems, then look at the other boards...... Reelboard and hopper board burnout is common too but not as bad as the previously mentioned boards.

 

I have built a test rig in the past to repair boards, yes i repaired a few mpu's successfully but as Andrew says it is time consuming and can be very expensive.

 

"IF" you can get them, a guaranteed working mpu is around £40 ish, lampboard around £15-£20 and psu board approx the same.... There used to be someone who bundled them on Ebay but i am told they have now ran out of stock finally....

 

At the end of the day with Epoch, it can cost you a minimum of around £35-50 (on the cheap side if you are lucky) to get a machine based with this tech running..... Buy a cheap one and think you have got a bargain, think again... They WILL cost you to get running...

 

Same go's for most "cheap" machines, unless you have a good supply of working spares, you are good with electronics and can repair damaged cct boards, or you know someone that can do said repairs, then leave well alone to avoid disappointment.

[stanmarsh14]

"IF" you can get them, a guaranteed working mpu is around £40 ish, lampboard around £15-£20 and psu board approx the same.... There used to be someone who bundled them on Ebay but i am told they have now ran out of stock finally....

 

Aye..... there was a chap in Derby that used to do Epoch parts packages and at a good price too (I've certainly had some good deals and great service off him), but he's not got owt in at present

[andrew96]

That's the trouble, there comes a point when repair is the only option! that's why I have spent time and trouble going to the bother of finding and repairing epoxy ancillary boards! who else is going to spend £96 on smd transistors for the lamp boards as once the stock of transistors are gone its gone! (transistors are going obsolete) so I stocked up!!