119 replies to this topic

[niallquinn]

Re the prizes ones, ceryainly all around the north-east, all were Maygay.  I never saw any others.  Nearly always Eastenders as well.

 

I remember winiing, several watches that lasted a few weeks, a cassette player, and a compilation tape of Meat Load and Bonnie Tyler!

 

NQ.

[stevedude2]

 

 

Did he come up with a Labyrinth 2?  25quid one.  Don't think it was ever released,   I've got a pic of it somewhere was posted on here or FF.

 

NQ.

Yeah I think he did.  Saw one in Barry Island a few years back to my astonishment.  £24 for a board but I got a jackpot thankfully.  Game-play suffers from the stake/prize ratio, same as most games.

[slasherx2]

Wouldn't mind knowing more about CLMS and the test phase if you have any info? Seems broken to me.

[edwardb]

Wouldn't mind knowing more about CLMS and the test phase if you have any info? Seems broken to me.

CLMS? Sorry that's an acronym I'm not familiar with. Test phase, you mean testing of games on site, or something else?

[slasherx2]

Apparently, CLMS is the place where all the machine performance figures are documented. Things like machine index, cash in box, etc. Perhaps it was under a different umbrella or something?

 

From what I've heard the whole test phase is absolute bollocks. At least in my opinion anyway.

 

I do think £100 jackpot can be made to work but the manufacturers caving to demands from everyone else makes it more difficult... then you have the test phase, make one game tight and it passes with flying colours, then just as people work out how to play that, the next game is even tighter, and eventually you have what we have now, flat profiles, rigged games. Takings supposedly down.

Edited by slasherx2, 01 August 2017 - 03:14 PM.

[phattbloke]

So if I were to make another fruit machine, what would you suggest I do differently to what is out there at the moment? I'm still not convinced by the 100 quid... But I guess it has to be on there somehow... Would a game like Roller Coaster with a 25 quid top, but a feature that paid 100 on there somewhere work? Assuming it had all the skill and cheats on it again?

[slasherx2]

Personally I think dond the big one and anything prior to that works with the exception of turbo. The issue with turbo is it saves up and pays a lump and if that comes around at the same time as the other compensators then you're in bother.

The betcom profile seems to nail it as well, albeit a lot aren't really fans of their games due to repetitive play.

The issue comes with the test phase in my opinion, from what I've heard anyway. Any fluctuation and that machine may as well be written off.

Then you have the pubs demanding flat profiles as already mentioned. People like streaks. You can't streak a £100 jackpot game it just doesn't work. Maybe a £200 streak but then you can't really have cheats. Would be good if skill features could make a comeback and have a 50/50 chance of showing maybe 20-30 quid before caving anyway, but they can't be as good as they used to be as machines can't afford it.

There's definitely a way for 100 but if they go to 150 then good luck ever fluking that while the pubs complain about fluctuating earnings.

Of course I could be talking complete bollocks lol

Edited by slasherx2, 02 August 2017 - 05:29 AM.

[edwardb]

Hi all

 

Just a quick update, I've had a bit of a rummage around and found a load of stuff, including my Epoch dev kit! So if I can find a Windows XP PC with a parallel port, I can download bin files to an Epoch board. Might be some fun to be had here.

 

Got all my backup CDs of game code and a few other goodies. I'll post them in due course. Getting married in a week so a lot going on!

 

Ed

[edwardb]

Oh my holy god............I got the Epoch compiler working.....on Windows 10!!! Rebuilt an old game, edited the code a little and.......

void InitialiseDisplays(void)
{
    DisplaysInitialise();
    whichalpha = ALPHA1x16Setup();                                                                    // Sets up vfd alpha driver
	DisplaySetCurrentDisplay(whichalpha);
    DisplaysRefreshStart(3);
	DisplayRefreshRate(8);
    DisplayDefineWindow( 1,whichalpha, 1, 1, 16, 1 );      // set up display size
    DisplaySetCurrentWindow( whichalpha );                                            // make alpha the current display
    DisplayClearWindow();                                                                                    // clear it and do std msg
	DelayMS(500);
//	AlphaPrintf(ALPHA_POS_0 "START UP        "); 
	AlphaPrintf(ALPHA_POS_0 "HELLO FRUIT EMU!");
}

https://www.imgpaste.net/image/D7Q6T

 

[Guitar]

So if I were to make another fruit machine, what would you suggest I do differently to what is out there at the moment? I'm still not convinced by the 100 quid... But I guess it has to be on there somehow... Would a game like Roller Coaster with a 25 quid top, but a feature that paid 100 on there somewhere work? Assuming it had all the skill and cheats on it again?

 

Make it £100 jackpot, but £3.33 per spin (3 games for a tenner). Which is eqivalent to 20p Play, £6 Jackpot.

 

The real problem is that the investment required is huge compared to the potential winnings. If you are thinking of making an emulated game, just make it 20/25/30p with a £10 Jackpot.

 

I'd rather win £10 + 9 repeats, than a straight £100 any day of the week.

[shaun2097]

Oh my holy god............I got the Epoch compiler working.....on Windows 10!!! Rebuilt an old game, edited the code a little and.......

void InitialiseDisplays(void)
{
    DisplaysInitialise();
    whichalpha = ALPHA1x16Setup();                                                                    // Sets up vfd alpha driver
	DisplaySetCurrentDisplay(whichalpha);
    DisplaysRefreshStart(3);
	DisplayRefreshRate(8);
    DisplayDefineWindow( 1,whichalpha, 1, 1, 16, 1 );      // set up display size
    DisplaySetCurrentWindow( whichalpha );                                            // make alpha the current display
    DisplayClearWindow();                                                                                    // clear it and do std msg
	DelayMS(500);
//	AlphaPrintf(ALPHA_POS_0 "START UP        "); 
	AlphaPrintf(ALPHA_POS_0 "HELLO FRUIT EMU!");
}

https://www.imgpaste.net/image/D7Q6T

 

awesome!! ...more please.....im loving youre insights. etc.....

Edited by shaun2097, 10 August 2017 - 09:09 PM.

[Hunty]

Very good read always wondered who had the ideas and put them all together thanks for this.

[edwardb]

When I get a bit of time, I'll upload some more game code and fun stuff - just got a lot on right now!

[Twostroker]

Great thread! I find it interesting there's not much mention of the development of club machines so far.

Were club machines only a small part of the industry? What was the thinking behind a decent club machine?

Great club machines all seem to have hidden quirks that you would have to be in the know about... eg regularly gamble £2 oranges to £60 but always stop there... or move back 3 so you can add again and then move back 3 and you've got the jackpot...was that gameplay engineered in or was it just 'compensator in our favor' all along?

Some seemed reasonably predictable with big jackpots so a few locals would keep the machines going for us and we'd take note on how much was going in and who played when. Fondly remember the days when two new machines would turn up. I was always playing just for fun so really enjoyed these great machines!

[edwardb]

Club machines were a much smaller part; sales were not a volume anywhere near the number of pub machines for obvious reasons.

 

BFG were of course the best at club machines, really, and had a small team who pretty much just did those. Global built most of their business on club machines for a long time. You might sell 100 to 500 of a particular model.

 

A lot of clubs were just conversions of AWP machines, and compensated in a similar way although (more often than not) with a lot more compensators for multiple streaks and other prizes.

 

The "quirks" you mention were more often than not put in on purpose, i.e. the machine has already decided your maximum win, and will just engineer a way to not let you exceed that. Non max-win controlled games would do it on a random chance, but of course, if you got a large win, the compensator tightens up and the machine will just take the money back eventually.....

 

I never coded one, personally, although (at Mazooma at least) most of the lads who did AWPs also did the occasional club machine.

 

If you never noticed, Club Pacman was just Crazy Fruits - BFG gave us the code for it and we cloned it....

[vectra666]

whilst were on about percentages etc, i've always wondered what kind of percentage do coin pushers work on as we know most of the coins go down the sides but how accurate is it? 

[TommyC]

Surely they are just chance.

[fruitman69]

The pushers we had used to average around the 20% Mark.

[fuzion]

I've been in arcades where when someone has played the pusher, the engineer or floor walker opens it up and redistributes the coins, bit of a con.

 

J

[edwardb]

Bit OT but pushers are actually quite a remarkable bit of engineering. They stick to their payout % like glue. 

 

The % is set by adjusting the metal "flaps" on the sides of the bed and the screws that poke up in the middle, which build the pile of coins. There are often two channels, left and right, that coins fall off and disappear forever (into the cashbox) and you can adjust how "open" those are, and therefore how many coins fall off into the box.

 

Simple but effective. When we did the AWP/pushers at Mazooma, the pushers were bang on % within £100 of throughput. No chance of that with an AWP!